everything wrong with the nevermind album

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everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by jack.brown8786 » Tue Sep 02, 2014 10:28 am

first thing's first: I'm not trolling. I'm educating. nothing I'm about to say is any more "opinion" than a professor's grade on an essay. "nevermind" is the essay and I'm the prof. you're not going to like this, but how about instead of instantly censoring me despite the fact that you let all kinds of idiots post, you actually attempt to refute the things I'm about to say.... this is one of the reasons this album is considered so great, b/c ppl like me aren't even allowed to speak.... this will probably be removed by tomorrow, sadly. that's how Kurt would have wanted it, right? I can't even post it on youtube b/c it's so long that it's considered spam.

if you really want to pretend like this is "non-constructive" and ban it just b/c it's true and you don't want to let the word out about how it's stolen when it's at its best, I can't do anything about it. you're like the guy with no brains who just punches anyone who disagrees with him b/c he doesn't have a better argument. banning me doesn't change the facts. this is the most original post on this entire board. anyway, on with the FACTS:

right off the bat, the very first riff is stolen. listen to Venom's Countess Bathory (youtube it). they were the first extreme metal band, Metallica's biggest influence even, along with every black, death, and thrash metal band of the early-mid 80's. the lyrics of this song couldn't get worse. "I feel stupid and contagious." "a mulato, an albino, a mosquito, my libido." most choruses on this album are meaningless 2 word phrases like this. IT SUCKS. "hello hello hello how low hello hello...." so bad. the solo is good on this track, but it's one of the very few on this album. at least this track has an intro... even if it is just the main riff (stolen) in acoustic form, sadly this is more than I can say for most other tracks on this album.

the next song's message is, "this is pop garbage but tons of morons are going to sing along with it." enough said really. "he's the one who likes all our pretty songs and he likes to sing along and he likes to shoot his gun but he knows not what it means when I say yeah." do I have to explain that to you morons? enjoy your pop trash that admits it's pop trash. "we can have some more, nature is a whore." wow, great rhyme there, the first phrase there has an average of less than 4 letters per word (this is actually higher than average for the bottom half of the lyrics on this album: FACT). more than enough said.

Come As You Are. I couldn't possibly trash this classic, could I? I wouldn't expect anyone who likes this album to be familiar with real albums, so this will come as a shock to you, but this guitarwork is also stolen. it's called "Eighties," what, have you never heard of Killing Joke? clowns. the song isn't even valid. before I move onto the next song though, I want to congratulate nirvana on the 1 word chorus on this one. great job, idiots.

breed. "i don't care i don't care i don't care i don't care" "i don't mind i don't mind i don't mind i don't mind." "even if you have, even if you need, i don't mean to stare, we don't have to breed, we can plant a house, we can build a tree." WOW, CLASSIC FIRST GRADE GRAMMAR/VOCABULARY. does it get any more simple or generic than this? the song structure on this one is: CHORUS #1, CHORUS #2, CHORUS #1 AGAIN, CHORUS #2 AGAIN. that's all. no intro, outro, bridge, nothing. SOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO BAD. a real song will be something like: INTRO, VERSE #1, BRIDGE, SOLO, VERSE #2, CHORUS, VERSE#3, CHORUS, OUTRO. or: INTRO, VERSE #1, CHORUS, BREAKDOWN, SOLO, CHORUS, VERSE #2, OUTRO.

Lithium. what is it with everyone thinking it's so great that he has soft verses and then hard choruses? I'm not saying the Pixies did it first, but I am willing to bet that they were the influences here. nirvana has all the energy of those guys without the meaning. the loud rocking chorus here? it goes, "yeah yeah yeah yeah......" does he really say "yeah" 24 times here? wow. there's 2 choruses on this one too. the 2nd goes, "I X you, I'm not gonna crack." he says that 8 times, substitute X for simple go-to words like love, like, kill, or miss. so boring. so generic. garbage. get over this bullshit.

Polly. the "verses" are a few short lines. every single word except for "amazes" and "instinct" requires a first grade reading level. the chorus is a string of 2-3 word phrases that are more simple than my toddler's daily observations. kurt messes up, starts the 2nd verse early, and then pretends it didn't happen. was this the first take? there is really only 1 instrument here, minimal percussion, minimal bass, a repetitive 2 second long melody repeated over and over. the melody doesn't switch up, ever. beginning to end, it stays as generic as the lyrics. it sucks.

territorial pissings. the verses have devolved. somehow. really, how could they get any more simple? they're 1 sentence each this time between the chorus "gotta find a way, a better way, when I'm there." notice how simple and generic each word in the chorus is, he just screams it over and over. there's no meaning. the verb is "find," the nouns are "way," and "there." it couldn't have less meaning. there is rarely any more imagery on the entire album. the 1 sentence verse? "Never met a wise man, if so it's a woman." so, this is why he sticks to 2 word phrases. "IF, THEN" statements don't even work that way, Kurt... and he can't even get his tenses right. I have to go to work. I'll tear up the rest of this POS later.

keep listening, donkeys. the best songs are stolen and the lyrics all suck anyway. the instrumentation is generic and boring. (actually the next song, "Drain You" isn't bad, it has a cool breakdown and it's far more poetic than anything else on the album, even if he's droning the whole time at least it's really dirty and unsettling, kind of makes you want to take a shower, it's unique really). most of the rest of it sucks (lounge act is also good). the last song is an obvious attempt to parallel the greatest album of all time - The Beatles' Revolver, on which the last song is that experimental and brilliant Tomorrow Never Knows.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Y2K-kyle » Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:25 am

What makes you think we like Nirvana or Nevermind?
otherimprov wrote:
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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by jack.brown8786 » Tue Sep 02, 2014 11:42 am

this is the "nirvana" subforum. I'm not dissing "Bleach," "In Utero," and especially not "Unplugged," but nevermind is highly rated and there's absolutely no reason for it that isn't related to a combination of bias and ignorance. if fans knew that the best of it was stolen from bands that have created entire subgenres of music and weren't ignorant of truly great albums they wouldn't hold nevermind in such high regard.

a common belief is that nirvana started grunge. I don't like or dislike the genre as a whole really, I can acknowledge Pearl Jam's Ten as an excellent work, for example. an example that disproves the "nirvana" started it nonsense. Ten was released in 08/91, nevermind was 09/91. the fact that nevermind is so popular with teens is no more important than the fact that bieber, backstreet boys, brit spears, or miley cyrus are.

especially teens of the 90's. they just love their sarcasm, irony, and black humor. terrible tastes. they mostly have this attitude, "MOM! GIVE ME SOME DAMN SPACE, WILL YA? NO I DON'T WANT ANY COOKIES! I'M GOING THROUGH SOME SERIOUS SHIT RIGHT NOW! NOBODY UNDERSTANDS ME!" it's a pathetic angsty phase.

nevermind is on the top of so many lists though when it is by far nirvana's worst album, discounting the 2 stolen riffs. this needs to be known. a critic that isn't retarded needs to acknowledge the facts already.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Fuzz Face » Tue Sep 02, 2014 1:32 pm

Dear sir!

First of all let me introduce myself as a student of culture, which is exactly why I feel entitled to have this debate with you and let´s settle this once and for all. Nevermind is not a bad album. Because as a matter of fact it HAD a huge audience and it altered the way rock music was produced until way after the Millennium and as a matter of fact the kind of impact it had does make it one of the greatest and most influential albums of all time. You don´t have to like it, just like you don´t have to like say... Miley Cyrus, or Justin Bieber, but to a large degree the quality and meaning of art of any kind is derived from the size of the audience it attracts and/or (just like with venom and Metallica) the kind of audience it attracts, thus anything that is produced and has an impact even remotely related to the one of Nevermind must be respected and considered as a serious creative product of pop culture regardless of personal preferences.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Y2K-kyle » Tue Sep 02, 2014 3:37 pm

Roman wins.
otherimprov wrote:
Thu Apr 07, 2016 6:17 am
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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by infinitegrunge » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:33 am

There's plenty to criticize about that album (any album, really) but your post is ridiculously assaultive, so no one's going to listen to you. Your criticism is pretty bad too. I mean, the lyrics on Nevermind are pretty lazy but you're not really adding anything to the discussion with what you're saying. I'm pretty sure everyone already knows that.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by infinitegrunge » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:38 am

jack.brown8786 wrote: nevermind is on the top of so many lists though when it is by far nirvana's worst album, discounting the 2 stolen riffs. this needs to be known. a critic that isn't retarded needs to acknowledge the facts already.
The whole reason it's on top of so many lists is because it sold a billion copies and a huge corporation continues to promote it because it continues to make them money. Plus it's really accessible. Like, seriously, it's AMAZING how accessible that album is. It has some absolutely amazing melodies, yet still manages to have a tiny amount of rawness compared to the rest of the huge commercial grunge bands of the era.

I agree with you wholeheartedly, but the criticism should go to our society and corporate oligarchy more than the album. Nevermind is pretty good even if it has lazy lyrics and isn't wholly original. Guess what? I'm pretty sure Mudhoney stole stuff too. I think stealing is fine as long as you add something to it. It's your opinion that they didn't. I disagree.

My opinion about Nevermind is that the first side is fucking awesome (except for "Lithium", which starts out great and drags on too long) and the second half sucks donkey dong. There's a waaaay better version of "Something In the Way" out there on a peel session, and that's the only song I even kinda like on the second half.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by jack.brown8786 » Wed Sep 03, 2014 3:18 pm

it doesn't matter how popular it is, it matters who it's popular with. this remains popular with teenagers, like any terrible yet successful "musician." it seems agreed that the best of the instrumentation is stolen and that the lyrics could be used to introduce preschoolers to English. what more is left in the album? the vocals? have anyone else sing this garbage, and it sells next to nothing. why is miley cyrus popular? the same damn reason.

@Fuzz Face. I'm not sure if you're trolling. you introduce yourself as "a student of culture" and "feel entitled...." you've got to be kidding me.... what is wrong with kids these days? this is the kind of person that would like this album though. why didn't you just say, "WHATEVER, MAN! THIS ALBUM IS- NO MOM, I DON'T WANT ANY COOKIES! GIVE ME SOME DAMN SPACE WHY DON'T YA? YOU'RE ALWAYS NAGGING ME! WHY DOESN'T ANYBODY UNDERSTAND ME? I'M GOING THROUGH SOME SERIOUS SHIT RIGHT NOW!" lol.... the sort of pitiful angst that only pathetic teenagers can relate to.

let me guess, your sense of humor involves irony, sarcasm, and black humor, right? one man's riot is another man's pseudo-intellectual dbag talk, I guess. I hate teenagers. it isn't exactly what you say, but the words' implications on your state of mind. the "choices" you "make" aren't "important." choices are dependent upon beliefs, tastes, intelligence, opportunity, body/brain chemistry, etc. none of which you "choose." you don't "choose" to believe that you can read ppl's minds, or "choose" to prefer apples to oranges. you don't "choose" how sane or intelligent you are, and these factor highly into the "decisions" you make. Jeffrey Dahmer didn't choose to be Jeffrey Dahmer any more than Bill Gates chose to be Bill Gates. it's luck. and it doesn't matter anyway b/c one day, no matter what, every member of our species will be dead. it's always a possibility in any given second, so given an infinite amount of time, it's only eventual. what the hell will it have mattered what you "chose" then, after everything you could have affected will be gone? you're X% smarter than a slug. every generation, humans get Y% smarter than the last, on average. therefore, it's only a matter of time before you are X% dumber than the average person, at which point you will be to them what a slug is to you. you're nothing. you're entitled to nothing. get this crazy nonsense out of your brain. face simple facts, get out of denial. you're ridiculous, grow up.

"OPINIONS" lol. there are only facts, you biased clowns. "yellow is better than blue." no, that's not an opinion, it's the statement of a biased idiot, fact. no color is better than any other color, fact. "Jimi Hendrix is a better guitarist than my grandmother." fact. you don't agree? well, you can agree with this then: "the ppl who believe the opposite to be true are more likely heavily biased and less intelligent than those who believe the statement to be true." you don't believe so? can you really tell yourself that: "the more intelligent you are, the less likely you are to believe that the grandmother is the better guitarist" isn't true? or: "the less sane you are, the more likely you are to believe it." if bias and outliers are the only explanations as to a certain belief, why can't it be said to be false? why does every stupid thought have to be "legitimate" under the protection of "subjectivity"? facts aren't subjective. Jimi Hendrix is a better guitarist than my grandmother. why should it suddenly be an "opinion" when "grandmother" is replaced with some other noun or pronoun? wouldn't that then imply that the "other noun or pronoun" is inherently BETTER than my grandmother? wait, you can't play solos of songs you haven't even written behind your back while tripping on LSD? you're most likely not a better guitarist than Hendrix. I don't even listen to him often, I prefer The Beatles, Rolling Stones, Bob Dylan, The Doors, Pink Floyd, Grateful Dead, Led Zeppelin, Black Sabbath, but I'm not going to say something stupid like "George Harrison is better anyway," b/c I know that even he would admit that wasn't so and bias doesn't affect me as strongly as it does others, and when it does I realize it. it's a simple logical process really. do I hate radiohead? yes. do professional critics agree that radiohead is the best the 90's has to offer? yes. why do I hate radiohead? I can't stand Thom's voice, it's full of self-pity and pompousness which is a horrible combination and therefore could never enjoy it no matter how good the instrumentation is. oh. I'm clearly biased. not so with "nevermind," it's a POS and its popularity can be explained with bias and ignorance.

forget it, opinions are filled with magic and wonder. they're all equally valid and beautiful in their own way like butterflies or rainbows. I enjoy eating bird droppings, myself, my favorite movie is Sharktopus, and my favorite activity is a toss up between pacing back and forth while listening to the Backstreet Boys and taking long walks on the beach. I'm not insane or stupid or anything though. also, I clearly suck.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Y2K-kyle » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:02 pm

Dude, I'm going to need you to chill out, and read what I have to say alright?

What you stated about Nevermind is YOUR OPINION, and did you HONESTLY think that coming on a forum with Nirvana being a big section, cause they popularized grunge and basically bashing it because you have your opinions about it, and expect us to agree with you? Or were you looking to start up a fight about why we think Nevermind is the "greatest album of all time?"

You must of not looked into how and why Nevermind is so popular? As everyone has said time and time again: It was all about timing. Nevermind came out during the right time. For many teens, including myself when I was a teenager, it spoke to them on a deep level and we could relate to the songs and to Kurt. Now as I've grown older, Nevermind isn't an album I play on repeat, but I like to listen to it every now and then because I know how important it was to me when I first listened to it and I still enjoy the songs.

Your main arguments are how the music is bad, how the lyrics are bad, how the some of the instrumentals are stolen from other artists, and so on. So, let's break it down:

First off, let me break some shocking news to you: MUSIC HAS NOT BE ORIGINAL IN A LONG, LONG TIME!

When it comes to the guitar, drums, bass, keyboard, and all the other instruments, there has not been anything new and original. Like comedians with jokes, they take jokes from one another, but the difference is that they take it and make it into their own thing.

For a music example, look at Queens of the Stone Age's song 3's & 7's. The main riff is from the riff from Smells Like Teen Spirit, which I think in you're argument the riff is also stolen from someone else. It's this way and will continue to be this way for a long time.

Another example is Led Zeppelin. Zeppelin is notorious for taking songs and claiming to be their own and so on. Does that make the albums the worst ever? Fuck no. No matter what the haters say, those albums have made an impact in culture and everyone associates the riffs to Zeppelin.

Now, you mentioned that one of the songs had a Pixies influence on it. You're right: they liked the Pixies and made some songs like the Pixies. What's the problem here? Many artists have done this time and time and time and time again. It's not going to change and that's no good reason to hate a song because it "sounds like a certain artist." For this case, it was intended because they loved the Pixies.

Second, the lyrics. You do understand who Kurt Cobain is right? Then you should know that Kurt wrote most of the lyrics for Bleach within a day before recording the album, my timing may be off here but the point is that he wrote the songs as soon as he went to the studio. He just made up some words and fucking went with it.

Also, he mentioned time and time that lyrics didn't mean jack shit to him. He didn't care about the lyrics if they made sense or not. So arguing about Kurt's songwriting is.....stupid and pointless because he didn't care. He never cared and if it worked for his music, which is what he cared about more than the lyrics, then he went with it. Hell, he changed lyrics to songs live cause he wanted to.

I can understand if you can't stand Nevermind. That's alright, but what's not alright is coming on here and saying that it shouldn't be as popular as it is because YOU don't like it. There's many albums that I don't like, and wished that people didn't like, but you don't see me going and saying THAT ALBUM SUCKS IT SHOULDN'T BE POPULAR!

Like I said previously, the main reason that Nevermind is popular is because it was released at the right time, and many, many people bought it because they heard the songs and connected to them.

Now, I questioned your reasoning for making this, and now that I've looked over your response, it was, in my opinion, your excuse to start some fights and to feel good about yourself. I say this because you insulted us under the pretension that we would somehow rise up and tell you why we thing you are wrong about Nevermind, and how Nevermind is the greatest album of all time. Who gave you the right to insult us because we would or could of disagreed with you? Honestly.

You sir, can have your reasons for disliking Nevermind, but that is no excuse for insulting people for liking this album. And I've already gave you a brief about the album and why it is considered important and why it is popular. If you can read all that, and yet still perceive us as some "donkeys" because we disagree with you, then there is nothing we can say to you because you don't want to understand and listen what others have to say. If this is how you act, then I'll advice you to stop here, and move on with your life.
otherimprov wrote:
Thu Apr 07, 2016 6:17 am
Pinch yourself Kyle and wake up from your sleep

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Pennyroyaltea » Wed Sep 03, 2014 8:39 pm

First off in your two paragraphs you are very stand offish, as if you were ready for a fight. You'd already typecasted every person on this forum before you'd even begun what you believe is a critique.

You say you aren't trolling with such gems as; "keep listening, donkeys." Seriously?

Now you are here to "educate"? What pray tell gives you the authority to do such a thing. You have came here believing that people here would listen to grunge and grunge alone, when that is just a drop in the bucket compared to how knowledgeable we all are about music in general.

Now as someone who has not only studied music but as actually given university lectures and written a thesis on grunge allow me to educate you.

Your number one quailm with Nirvana seems to be the simplicity of Nirvana, but i'll have you know that on many occasions Kurt was very open about how simple Nirvana was. About how elementry the music was, it was done on purpose. But why? Because it was their music and as musicains they have every right to be as simple or complex as they chose. Kurt has even been quoted as saying
Kurt Cobain wrote:We're just musically and rhythmically retarded. We play so hard that we can't tune our guitars fast enough. People can relate to that.
Now, i'll have you know that Venom is one of my all time favorite bands. I've loved them for over a decade and have known of them longer than I have known of Nirvana. And you have to be trying really hard to make the connection that that riff was stolen. They have the same rhythm scales, but so do Iced Earth and Iron Maiden, or Judas Priest and Heart. That doesn't mean they stole from each.

This is going to come as a complete shock but you aren't the only person whose heard of Venom, crazy I know!

You seem to have a big problem with the lyrics; in Kurt's journals he mentions about how much he doesn't want his songs to have meaning. So he'd actually write lyrics first and distort them to a shell of it's original meaning.

So just to understand, they are idiots for having a one word chorus? They are idiots for writing music in a way they chose to do so? Since they went against traditional standards for music they must be stupid? You must have this note for anyone who ever tried to do something different ever.

It's good that you've noticed that you need a low grade reading level or that they are "more simple than my toddlers observations" is good, you've actually gotten something right in this mass of persnickety assumptions! Kurt actually said, in response to being asked as to why his songs were so simple he said he wanted them to be elementary, to be simple. So I guess you if take enough stabs in the dark you'll eventually hit something!

The simple fact (please note that this is how the term "fact" is used correctly since there seems to be some confusion on your end being the definition of fact is; something that truly exists or happens : something that has actual existence according to Merriam-Webster.) So again the simple fact that you claim that the Beatles wrote the best album of all time speaks volumes.

Now I could sit here and just stoop down to the level I know you're expecting me too but I won't.

What I will do is leave you with this, I genuinely hope that your toddler grows up to be a massive, die hard Nirvana fan.
shanze wrote:And you will. You will.

Then you put your spell on him and Jerry shall be yours.

FOREVER!

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by SKUNCHBAG » Wed Sep 03, 2014 10:23 pm

'Tis okay bud, you sure know a lotta stuff. Now go diss the Foo Fighters.

Oh, and by the way, have some cumbia. Y villera, mejor. Piolavago.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by otherimprov » Wed Sep 03, 2014 11:23 pm

I KNOW YOURE JOKING. CUT IT OUT .
Eat your water and drink your vegetables

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Canucker » Thu Sep 04, 2014 2:56 am

The dickish tone of the first paragraph of this thread makes it not worth reading any further...so I didn't.

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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by PunkingtonGrunge » Thu Sep 04, 2014 9:50 am

jack.brown8786 wrote:@Fuzz Face. I'm not sure if you're trolling...
Followed by -obvioustrollisobvious- insults :lol:
Now I think it's alright, to feel inhuman...
Comin' at ya quiet and underwhelming from the unremarkable soundscapes of Farmer Jan!!!11!1!1one!!1
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Re: everything wrong with the nevermind album

Post by Zodiac_n_Black » Thu Sep 04, 2014 12:17 pm

Canucker wrote:The dickish tone of the first paragraph of this thread makes it not worth reading any further...so I didn't.
+1
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