Soft Grunge????

Ripped jeans, flannel, facial hair, etc.

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SKUNCHBAG
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by SKUNCHBAG » Tue Mar 24, 2015 8:24 am

I've sought help but got none. Doctors either don't believe me when I say I'm well fed because I'm too skinny and then tell me I should eat more for the problems to disappear... Or they DO believe me, but seem to have no idea on what's wrong because every single analysis says I'm okay. But I'm not okay, and I've kept telling them I'm not, still it doesn't seem like there's something they can do for me. I don't know.
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Canucker
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Canucker » Tue Mar 24, 2015 3:06 pm

grappler wrote:I suppose there will always be those who jump on the bandwagon when things get popular, and I don't mean that as a blanket criticism of people. Even in the "Grunge" era there were plenty of people that wore the stuff cause it was the next cool thing. Practically everyone I knew had a pair of doc, ripped jeans and a flannel shirt, but somehow there was a sense of authenticity to it because it was the moment these kids came out of. I think the difference with the current generation is that there's a lot of direct appropriation of moments of the past without really making it their own. Just a couple of years ago 80s style was the big thing, and before that was a rehash of the hipsters, and now the 90s... And they're not so much developments of these musical and cultural moments as they are adoptions of them. Something like Soft Grunge seems like just another symptom of that. itll be interesting to see what happens once this 90s fad fades... Maybe all these people will get back into Emo again and start sweeping their hair over 1 eye. That would be pretty meta! Lol
grunge was seen as a throwback to the 70s.....no more sleek clean modern 80s look....mixtures of punk,metal (pre glam) classic rock sounds....no more keyboard/synth sounds....some acoustic music thrown in even....... what made it seem authentic then was it was anti 80s which had a lot of greed driven fake bs going on.....and that always ALWAYS comes back in music....so right now its pretty much needed....a cry for help even....cus even punk got absorbed into the mainstream..... grunge totally did....but the ones who were there before it got big got big with it....not to say the very first bands on the scene....but really think about who sold the most punk ablums.....Blink 182 and Greenday....not Ramones and Sex Pistols.....I'm rambling....its dinner....I'll shut up.

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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by grappler » Tue Mar 24, 2015 5:05 pm

Well, yeah, I agree that "grunge" has more to do with the 70s rock or metal, than 80s glam. Makes sense since a lot of those musicians grew up on bands from the 70s. I also agree that some "real" is needed, wether it's "grunge" or something else, but the problem is the music industry today (and a lot of pop culture that kids buy into) puts image ahead of substance (much like the 80s), so not only do you get a lot of stuff that's crap, but you also get stuff like "soft grunge", which is all about image void of ideology.

As far as who gets absorbed into the mainstream (if we're talking about "real" bands) comes down to a lot of factors. Green Day got a lot of commercial success because they packaged a kind of commercialized image of punk with simple short melodic radio friendly songs. I find it hard to even call them "punk"... They kind of took a punk aesthetic and sanitized the violence and anti social aggression out of it. It's akin to watching New Kids On The Block singing God Save The Queen... They can say the words, but it doesn't mean I beleieve them.

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Canucker
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Canucker » Tue Mar 24, 2015 11:45 pm

The Sexpistols are more of a New Kids On the Block then most any band out there....they were put together by a manager who owned a clothing store and used to promote what that store sold. When it came time to replace the Bass player the manager chose someone who couldn't play but rather looked good in the part and was easy to control. They were manipulated in order to grab headlines. They just happened to be a hard to handle group of people but it just happened to work to their advantage. They just happen to be selling the right thing at the right time.
If the Ramones are to be considered the first Punk Rock band and generally they are, how sanitized is Greenday by comparison really? What is considered "radio friendly" just changed over the years. Short catchy songs, some antisocial, some love songs all under three minutes played with speed. The Violence in punk you could probably go back and connect to Iggy pop's self mutilation.....and non-punks reaction to punks.....Darby Crash of the Germs was just doing a straight up copy of Iggy (peanut butter included) and that appealed to the younger punks in California who were coming in from the Suburbs (Huntington beach......Black Flag, Circle Jerks and so on)...who eventually attracted jocks converted to punks because of the appeal of growing violence at shows and the anything goes attitude found there.... Violence in punk in england was more of a spectacle, way to grab headlines....starting with Vivian westwood (the bands managers girlfriend\clothing designer) slapping some woman at a supposedly non eventful Pistols show in order to cause a scene and hopefully make the show newsworthy (which apparently worked)...the girls boyfriend jumped in and then band supporters followed suit.....early punk show voilence was to get attention and or let off steam....it became headline news and interpreted by the outside world as real aggressive so new people coming in saw it as an ok and important part of the scene....just like safety pins and other assorted clothing items...... if the pistols came out today it would be like Hot Topic putting together a band in order to model their apparel and see how many twitter followers and "likes" they could get all the while inviting A&R guys to their shows in order to get a Major Lable deal ASAP.
Greenday started as friends getting together to play music and take part in shows at a DIY venue which was partly run by bands that played there (Gilman Street). They had no managment and put out vinyl on a label run by an ex hippy (Lawrence Livermore) and eventually had enough music for a full length....it did well so they did another....it wasn't till their third album that they left the indie and went to a major....as a results of growing a grassroots following that was huge and having none of their own business sense to keep it totally DIY....their "lets give this a try" attitude paid off......yeah their music eventually became shit but the were never a prefab band that was just designed to sell clothing and grab the medias attention by any desperate means necessary....they just did what they wanted and it worked......I guess you could say the same about the Newkids....they wanted to dance and sing and it worked.....you could say it about most any musical performer that reached a large audience.

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Sonshine
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Sonshine » Wed Mar 25, 2015 3:23 am

I think you're all over analyzing shit.
Why can't we simply listen to what is pleasing to our ears?

Is there a lo of shit music being marketed to the masses?
Yes, there is, but no one is forcing you to buy it.

I think the most unfortunate part of commercialized music is having it stuffed down the public's throats via tv commercials or "intro music" on shows like Good Morning America.
I swear to GAWD if I hear Let It Go or that stupid Shake it Off song one more time, someone's getting punched in the throat.

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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by grappler » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:13 am

I think you're right, Sonshine. In the end it comes down to the music. Commercial or not if it doesn't work for the ears and moves you, it doesnt really matter.

Regarding things becoming mainstream... Was reading an interview with Kim Thayil about flannel shirts where he mentioned wearing flannel before it was mainstream "fashion" and asked the rhetorical question as to whether he should stop wearing it now because its hip (or something to that effect). In the end, just because things get popular doesn't mean you shouldn't partake.

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Sonshine
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Sonshine » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:53 am

I totally agree.
It is actually far more "indie" to just fucking like what you like and admit it, than to turn your nose up because something is "popular". Holy shit people. That is seriously the clear-cut definition of a follower!

Sorry (not sorry) for my potty mouth.

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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by grappler » Wed Mar 25, 2015 10:12 am

I know what you mean and agree. I've known people that would only listen to bands that are completely obscure (regardless of how shit they are) and turns their noses up at anything that has gotten commercial success... It got quite annoying. I can respect anyone who just likes what they like regardless of public opinion, or the opinion of the "cool" crowd.

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incessantmace
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by incessantmace » Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:21 pm

I love Journey, so there's that.
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Y2K-kyle
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Y2K-kyle » Wed Mar 25, 2015 1:47 pm

incessantmace wrote:I love Journey, so there's that.
Who doesn't?! I have two albums on vinyl from my parents collection.

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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by grappler » Wed Mar 25, 2015 2:33 pm

incessantmace wrote:I love Journey, so there's that.
Don't stop believin' was in our wedding.

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Canucker
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Canucker » Wed Mar 25, 2015 6:31 pm

I've gotten what can be viewed as bitch on here the odd times and I'm sorry about that. Its not intentional....its lack of sleep and probably a few other contributing factors....... very passionate about music and sometimes that just takes over..... and the fact that I type fast......Steve Perrys solo stuff is way better then Journey.....oh yeah I also rarely say "in my opinion"....I just state it like its fact! ;-p



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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by grappler » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:06 pm

I hear ya, Canucker. Intent and tone sometimes get lost in translation online. I enjoy the discussion never the less.

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Canucker
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by Canucker » Wed Mar 25, 2015 8:23 pm

I don't think I've ever actually pissed anyone off on here enough for them to say it. When you get right down to it people around here are pretty laid back. Slackers!

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incessantmace
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Re: Soft Grunge????

Post by incessantmace » Wed Mar 25, 2015 9:56 pm

Spence tells it like it is 8-)
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